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opencog-learn commits / 1250ddb

Invention of industrial steam engine of modern era.
1250ddb4c3238318a3f6aff377d64cddee8fbdca
by Linas Vepštas <linasvepstas@gmail.com> · 2026-01-24T02:03:41.000Z

Changed files (1) +181 -4

learn-lang-diary/learn-lang-diary-part-ten-F.lyx +181 -4
……@@ -5716,12 +5716,189 @@ But still,
57165716 whose name I can't remember.
57175717\end_layout
57185718
5719\begin_layout Itemize
5720Engineered:
5719\begin_layout Standard
5720So one of my daydreams,
5721 in pursuing the tokenized pair–correlation systems is that this is a way of obtaining symbolic ontological relationships between
5722\begin_inset Quotes eld
5723\end_inset
5724
5725things
5726\begin_inset Quotes erd
5727\end_inset
5728
5729.
5730 Early into this experiment,
5731 I discover that my par relationship are naturally these very high–dimensional vectors,
5732 and that this leads very naturally to a fuzzy categorization problem.
5733 I take my high–dimensional sphere,
5734 and slap a k–means or whatever clustering algo onto it.
5735 And if I squint,
5736 doing k–means by letting the points attract one–another
5737\begin_inset Quotes eld
5738\end_inset
5739
5740gravitationally
5741\begin_inset Quotes erd
5742\end_inset
5743
5744 starts looking a lot like gradient descent.
5745 So,
5746 although I started with tokenized data,
5747 and hoped to discover a symbolic ontology out of it,
5748 what really happened was that a vector representation happened
5749\begin_inset Quotes eld
5750\end_inset
5751
5752automatically
5753\begin_inset Quotes erd
5754\end_inset
5755
5756,
5757 and the ontology emerges only from clustering.
57215758\end_layout
57225759
5723\begin_layout Itemize
5724axiomatic structure is predefined
5760\begin_layout Standard
5761And yet,
5762 these clusters have specific labels.
5763 And the relationships between clusters is also categorizable.
5764 So,
5765 in my daydream,
5766 I am discovering axioms and inference rules.
5767 Which is something that LLM's seem not capable of,
5768 at this time,
5769 or rather,
5770 (and this is important) ***not automatically***.
5771\end_layout
5772
5773\begin_layout Standard
5774That is,
5775 I can as an LLM to extract logical relationships between things,
5776 but as the human engineer,
5777 I have to have that logical system specified,
5778 a priori.
5779 Can I ask the LLM to extract axioms and inference rules and relationships,
5780 do novo?
5781 No,
5782 not at all,
5783 impossible.
5784 I already tried,
5785 been there,
5786 done that.
5787 Claude can talk a big game – its been trained on AI textbooks,
5788 – but it has no clue whatsoever what any of it means,
5789 so when you ask it to do something,
5790 its like some high–school sophomore handing in some mediocre essay that poorly regurgitates what the teacher had written on the blackboard only hours earlier.
5791\end_layout
5792
5793\begin_layout Standard
5794So,
5795 for me,
5796 its not AGI–ish until it can infer relations and inference rules from scratch,
5797 without human intervention.
5798 And so far,
5799 I believe that my frequentist counting approach,
5800 plus clustering,
5801 can achieve this,
5802 and have not been dissuaded from this vision.
5803 But its also a vision I have been utterly unable to communicate to anyone else;
5804 something about how I express it gets pooh–poohed.
5805 Oh well.
5806 As always,
5807 the question is how to find the time to build this system.
5808\end_layout
5809
5810\begin_layout Standard
5811And so,
5812 circling back to the original topic:
5813 can I build tools to build the tools?
5814 I'm trying to get Claude to write Atomese for me,
5815 and it sucks.
5816 I have various ideas on how to get Claude better at this.
5817 The bad news is Claude is proprietary,
5818 and I can be cut off from it from little notice,
5819 and replacing with a different LLM is ...
5820 uncertain.
5821\end_layout
5822
5823\begin_layout Standard
5824Above,
5825 I described the
5826\begin_inset Quotes eld
5827\end_inset
5828
5829steam engine for the modern era
5830\begin_inset Quotes erd
5831\end_inset
5832
5833?
5834 Can I build a steam engine for myself?
5835 Err,
5836 well,
5837 what I need is not just domain–specific,
5838 but the domain is opaque:
5839 I'm running design experiments.
5840 I do know how to extract deontic logic from text,
5841 I don't know how to extract experimental software design logic from text.
5842\end_layout
5843
5844\begin_layout Standard
5845I did,
5846 at one point,
5847 try to build a memory prosthesis for Claude.
5848 I should get back to that project,
5849 someday.
5850 That is worthy.
5851 And it would be a prosthesis not just for Claude,
5852 but for something I could even run locally,
5853 on the GPU's right here.
5854\end_layout
5855
5856\begin_layout Standard
5857Well,
5858 OK,
5859 lets wrap it up.
5860 What have I learned?
5861 Yes,
5862 LLM's can be used as a perceptual system into text,
5863 and yes,
5864 asking the LLM to extract logical relationships from text,
5865 and attaching that logic to a symbolic reasoner is the paradigm that is driving,
5866 will drive the next number of decades of economic,
5867 industrial growth.
5868 No doubt about it.
5869\end_layout
5870
5871\begin_layout Standard
5872I guess I see this
5873\begin_inset Quotes eld
5874\end_inset
5875
5876early
5877\begin_inset Quotes erd
5878\end_inset
5879
5880,
5881 before 98% of the general population.
5882 But I see it
5883\begin_inset Quotes eld
5884\end_inset
5885
5886late
5887\begin_inset Quotes erd
5888\end_inset
5889
5890:
5891 the 2% of the industry insiders already know this,
5892 and are already building out the data centers,
5893 and sucking down the investment capital for it.
5894 So,
5895 ehh.
5896\end_layout
5897
5898\begin_layout Standard
5899Life goes on.
5900 Later,
5901 dude.
57255902\end_layout
57265903
57275904\begin_layout Section*